Invision Power Board Or vBulletin? For KWWHunction.

[eLight]

Which do you prefer? In specific, for KWWHunction. This poll isn't going to be the flick of the switch either, it's generally here to gather peoples opinions and ideas.

Consider the following:

• vBulletin 3 series is EOL, or at least is very soon.
• vBulletin 4 is seemingly a flawed product, or perceived this way.
• vBulletin 4 doesn't offer any considerable changes or improvements to vBulletin 3 besides a different code base.
• Invision requires large amounts of templating in order to maintain a sense of familiarity. It would require a completely custom KWWHunction IPB theme.
• There would need to be changes made in order to maintain KWWHunction features, some of which may or may not be transferable in a conversion such as the websites on your user profile.
• IPB comes with an easy to customize Mobile theme.
• vBulletin is generally known to all globally as it has been the benchmark since the ealy 00's.
• Depending on an upgrade or conversion to IPB, KWWHunction may require more or less hardware resources, more than likely more adding to the costs of running the website.
• Also, Moderators may not be familiar with tools and as such moderating may take a while to resume to normal operations. Same thing with administrators.
• Things would generally be found in different places and as such members may be easily confused by a different software if we were to change.

This isn't to say that we're going to change or not. Though it is on the tables. I just wish to gather some community input and ideas.

Look forward to your responses

eLight Reviewed by eLight on 5th Apr 2011. Invision Power Board Or vBulletin? For KWWHunction. Which do you prefer? In specific, for KWWHunction. This poll isn't going to be the flick of the switch either, it's generally here to gather peoples opinions and ideas. Consider the following: vBulletin 3 series is EOL, or at least is very soon. vBulletin 4 is seemingly a flawed product, or perceived this way. vBulletin 4 doesn't offer any considerable changes or improvements to vBulletin 3 besides a different code base. Invision requires large amounts of templating in order to Rating: 5

[Terror]

Mhm, to be honest v Bulletin.

But I'd rather xenforo.com

[SuicidalMedia]

Even though that vBulletin 3 won't be developed anymore, I'm 100% sure that there won't be any major vulnerabilities. Biggest Internet Communities are using vBulletin 3, not only because:

• It's easy to use.
• It really doesn't spend that much resources like IPB does.
• It can be lite without having to remove bunch of unnecessary things like on IPB.
• You can make anything out of it with little HTML/CSS knowledge.
• Everyone is familiar with it.

Those are some of the reasons, it's true that vBulletin 3 has bunch of released modifications, and pretty much all of them are supported. But the important thing is that no matter what they try to do with XenForo, IPB and vBulletin 4 they can never achieve the same thing like they achieved with vBulletin 3, it was and it remained the best commercial forum software.

[Hyperz]

Even though that vBulletin 3 won't be developed anymore, I'm 100% sure that there won't be any major vulnerabilities.

Ignorance is bliss. History has proven vB to be one of the most insecure but also the most wide spread BB software. That's a dangerous combination. Anyone who paid a bit of attention during history lessons in school will know that by knowing the past you can make more accurate assumptions and decisions in the future. Point being, new vulnerabilities being found is a likelihood. Anyone who has worked with vB's code base and has some basic understanding of programming and security will tell you that vB is insecure by nature because of the way the underlying code and API was written. When it comes to its plugin system it doesn't enforce secure code trough its API. The code base is old, poorly optimized and not well thought out security-wise. The only fix is a total rewrite like Invision did with IPB 3.

Biggest Internet Communities are using vBulletin 3.

That's because up until recently there was nothing around that was competing vB in terms of features and usability. Times change though. Nowadays vB is miles behind IPB 3, let alone IPB 3.1 (and we won't even mention the soon to be released 3.2). It is behind in virtually all aspects - performance, security, code-base, maintainability, useability, price and the list goes on. Lots of these big communities, especially those who are well maintained, are switching to better alternatives. Lots of new sites are now avoiding Jellysoft software. Anyone claiming otherwise is either as ignorant as they come, has a biased opinion or simply likes to think they know a few things about the technical side while in reality they are as green as they come.

It really doesn't spend that much resources like IPB does.

It consumes a lot more resources than IPB 3. This not a biased opinion but a fact. And one that can easily be proven by setting up a test environment and simulating unique traffic. Everyone is able to do the test. While the performance difference will be nearly non-existend on small sites, under large stress IPB will run circles around vB. This goes back to the outdated code base, which by the way is used in vB 4 too, but with a bit of extra bloat to further slow it down. It's the Crysis of BB software, only difference is that Crysis looks good. vB does not. Perhaps take off your vBulletin T-shirt and give it a go, hmm? It's easy to make a claim and present it as being a fact because it makes your favorite software/brand/e-penis look good/big.

It can be lite without having to remove bunch of unnecessary things like on IPB.

So let me get this straight, you claim it doesn't consume a lot of resources, only to go on and say you can make it lite. Tell me, if it isn't lite now then just what the hell is it ? Exactly. The only way you'll make vB lite by is removing it altogether or do what Jellysoft should have done with vB 4 and re-think + re-write EVERYTHING. It are not the features that make vB slow.

You can make anything out of it with little HTML/CSS knowledge.

Same goes for most other BB's, including IPB. The difference being that IPB's ACP is actually usable and straight forward.

Everyone is familiar with it.

Familiar with what exactly? What does IPB have that is so radically different from vB from a users perspective? Nothing. From a webmasters perspective it doesn't matter because IPB's ACP is functional, well structured and very straight forward. This is in sharp contrast to vB ACP, which DOES take getting used to for new users.

But the important thing is that no matter what they try to do with XenForo, IPB and vBulletin 4 they can never achieve the same thing like they achieved with vBulletin 3, it was and it remained the best commercial forum software.

What did vB 3 achieve? Or rather, what did it achieve that IPB 3 hasn't so far? And how, according to your oh so professional opinion, is it "the best" when everything you just claimed was based on a biased opinion that doesn't hold water?

Everyone, including me will have a biased opinion. There's nothing wrong with personal preference. But don't turn assumptions in to facts if you haven't got the slightest clue. Again, we're all biased, but there's a big difference between being biased because of assumptions or "i haz it so it iz teh best" mentality, and being biased because after some research you've came to a conclusion based on reproducible facts.

Have a good day.

[Mr Happy]

vBulletin was the best commercial community script of the early 00's but AOL was the best search engine too. You have to move and adapt with the times.
Any feature you say cannot be converted is a limit on the admin and his coding abilities and not on the script.
Staff and most of the active members are intelligent so implying they will have trouble with the new layout is an excuse and an insult to their intelligence.
Jasons comment about the html and CSS is also a terrible excuse. Any good designer and coder can create any layout just like vBulletin. A poor coder or designer will struggle.
Jason's comment about IPB's resources are also false. vBulletin is very heavy compared to IPB if you have the settings optimized correctly. Kids who import hundreds of useless mods and plugins without activating any of the optimizing settings give IPB an undeserved resource hog name.

The simple matter of fact is KWWHunction can't stay with vBulletin forever.It either moves now or leaves it another year when it's forced to move. Either way it's only a matter of time.

EDIT:
For those that don't know KWWHunction was previously converted to IPB by the old staff over a year ago. The theme wasn't converted but the site layout, posts and members were all successfully transferred. It all seamed to work perfectly and flawlessly.

[r0ck]

vBulletin was the best commercial community script of the early 00's but AOL was the best search engine too. You have to move and adapt with the times.
Any feature you say cannot be converted is a limit on the admin and his coding abilities and not on the script.
Staff and most of the active members are intelligent so implying they will have trouble with the new layout is an excuse and an insult to their intelligence.
Jasons comment about the html and CSS is also a terrible excuse. Any good designer and coder can create any layout just like vBulletin. A poor coder or designer will struggle.
Jason's comment about IPB's resources are also false. vBulletin is very heavy compared to IPB if you have the settings optimized correctly. Kids who import hundreds of useless mods and plugins without activating any of the optimizing settings give IPB an undeserved resource hog name.

The simple matter of fact is KWWHunction can't stay with vBulletin forever.It either moves now or leaves it another year when it's forced to move. Either way it's only a matter of time.

EDIT:
For those that don't know KWWHunction was previously converted to IPB by the old staff over a year ago. The theme wasn't converted but the site layout, posts and members were all successfully transferred. It all seamed to work perfectly and flawlessly.

have to agree my IPB installation is way faster then my vbulletin was...I say got IPB or open source as eventually you will need to change

[SuicidalMedia]

@Mr Happy
It's not a terrible excuse at all. Most of the Managers of boards powered by IPB are too lazy to explore and code new stuff. I have seen around 20 customized IPB boards, while I have seen TONS of HIGHLY customized vBulletin 3 boards. I have tested the IPB 3.x.x, and you really need to spend a lot of time with it, just to know its structure.

My comment was about the IPB's template structure, it's way more heavy than vBulletin's. Of course, you can make the lite one, but that involves removing of certain things, which requires knowing of the IPB's structure, because if you don't know what's ok to remove, you'll fuck something up.

[Mr Happy]

@Mr Happy
It's not a terrible excuse at all. Most of the Managers of boards powered by IPB are too lazy to explore and code new stuff. I have seen around 20 customized IPB boards, while I have seen TONS of HIGHLY customized vBulletin 3 boards. I have tested the IPB 3.x.x, and you really need to spend a lot of time with it, just to know its structure.

My comment was about the IPB's template structure, it's way more heavy than vBulletin's. Of course, you can make the lite one, but that involves removing of certain things, which requires knowing of the IPB's structure, because if you don't know what's ok to remove, you'll fuck something up.

How does that affect KWWHunction? So what if other webmasters are too lazy to customize a layout. It's not as if any of these "lazy" webmasters or poor designers or coders will be working on KWWHunction or at least I should hope they aren't.

[SuicidalMedia]

Well, yeah. Let's just hope that new Managers won't be that lazy like the old ones when it comes to the site design.

[House_maniac]

ipb is userfriendly and they are constantly adding new futures only thing that vb has is vbseo which is better than ipbseo from what i heard but ipb is better in many ways if you don't want heavy skins you can customize the default ipb skin which is kinda light or make a custom one